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Germany is still in shock. Last week, research by the German research center Correctiv revealed that right-wing extremists, ADF and CDU politicians and business representatives held a secret meeting to forge a ‘master plan’ for Germany’s migration policy.

The aim of this plan: to expel millions of people from Germany – regardless of whether they have a German passport or not. The criteria determining which people would be affected by ‘remigration’ – as the right-wing extremists called it – are based on racism, anti-Semitism and Islamophobia.

That is why tens of thousands of people took to the streets in recent days and demonstrated against right-wing extremism and especially the AFD. For example in Berlin, Brandenburg, Freiburg, Cologne, Frankfurt am Main, Munich and Potsdam, where the secret meeting took place. More demonstrations are planned in many other cities until the end of the month.

What’s going on in Germany? How did the country get to this point? And should the AFD really be banned, as many protesters demand? Felix Neumann, a political scientist with a focus on right-wing extremism, provides answers.

Were you surprised by what the Correctiv investigation revealed?
Felix Neumann: Yes and no. No, because it is known that various AFD actors regularly meet and network with right-wing extremist organizations. But what surprised me first and foremost is how senior the AFD politicians and the other guests who attended this meeting were. For example, Martin Sellner, head of the identity movement. He is very well known in the right-wing German scene and has a lot to say. Secondly, I was surprised that the subject of ‘remigration’ was specifically discussed during this meeting and that there was clearly an attempt to develop plans for this.

“Remigration”. That sounds so innocent. Where does the term actually come from?
Yes, remigration is a very strong trivialization, a weakening. Because remigration, as the right understands it, ultimately means deportation. And depending on who they think would be among the people who would be ‘remigrated’, in Germany we are talking about several million people who would be deported to North Africa or – as the Nazis had already planned – to Madagascar. This weakening is a typical communicative strategy of the right that has been observed for decades.

What is the domestic political situation in Germany that such a secret meeting could even take place?
I do not believe that specific political developments led to this specific event. Right-wing circles wanted to network at the secret meeting. They wanted to acquire financial resources to establish some kind of ‘alternative media system’. That means they wanted to make influencers big so they could spread their own stories across the media landscape. And they just wanted to exchange ideas about remigration. This meeting was therefore purely strategic in nature. What can be said is that for years we have been observing more and more meetings in which right-wing extremist circles, including the AFD, strategically network.

And since when have these networking events increased?
Since the AFD came into existence in 2013. Since then we have seen how right-wing extremist clubs, organizations and even private individuals try to attach themselves to the party. The 2015 migration crisis and the corona pandemic have fueled this development.

Has the rise of the AFD increased right-wing extremism in Germany or is it the other way around: did the AFD emerge from right-wing extremism?
When it was founded, the AFD was quite Eurocritical. There certainly wasn’t as much right-wing and right-wing extremism as there is now. But over the years the party has disgusted or discarded more and more of its liberal representatives. At the same time, the right wing, around Björn Höcke, grew in size. The AFD did not emerge from right-wing extremism. But: She caused the language to change in the media, in parliament and even throughout Germany. Hate, agitation, black-and-white thinking, enemy images – all this has increased thanks to the AFD. And that in turn promotes social change, which is reflected in violence motivated by right-wing extremism.

Tens of thousands of people across Germany are now forming demonstrations against right-wing extremism. What can these demonstrations achieve?
You can definitely make a statement. In fact, it is estimated that only about 15 to 20 percent of the population in Germany supports the AFD. That means: 80 percent of the population is against the AFD. But as is so often the case, in the public debate you only notice those who shout the loudest. Those who do not support the AFD generally do not actively demonstrate this rejection. With the current demonstrations, this silent majority is now visible. For those affected by right-wing extremist violence, this is a powerful sign of solidarity. Germany also takes a position on domestic and foreign policy. This even makes sense from an economic perspective. Studies have shown that the more AFD increases in Germany, the less attractive our country becomes for the industry.

Why is the public so focused on the AFD after this secret meeting? At least some CDU politicians, right-wing radical groups and well-known entrepreneurs also participated.
This is probably due, on the one hand, to the fact that the AFD sits as an elected party in the Bundestag and, on the other hand, to the fact that it has the greatest potential to realize the ideas exchanged during the secret meeting. incorporated into actual German politics. This worries many people.

Many protesters are now calling for a ban on the AFD. Where does this idea come from?
Germany is a so-called “defensive democracy”. This means: Due to the experiences we had with National Socialism, we have created legal opportunities to deal with extremist parties. A ban is one of the options that should be used in the worst case. Germany has only banned a party twice. The Reich Socialist Party (SRP) was banned in 1952 and the German Communist Party (KPD) in 1956. In the 2010s they tried for a third time with the far-right NPD. But that didn’t work.

Why not?
On the one hand, there were too many intermediaries from the Office for the Protection of the Constitution in the party. On the other hand, the process took a very long time, which led to the Federal Constitutional Court eventually assessing the role of the NPD as rather unimportant in the political structure and deciding against a ban.

And what do you think about banning the AFD?
There are many good arguments for a ban on AFD. On the one hand, the AFD is already considered right-wing extremist in some states. On the other hand, it poses a real threat to democracy because it has a large number of voters. However, I am still not in favor of a ban on the AFD. At least not now.

Is now a bad time?
Yes. Through the process with the NPD, we know that it may take several years before a court issues a ban on the party. If we started the process now, the AFD could use this fact to its advantage in the upcoming state elections, the federal elections and the smaller regional elections. She could step into the role of victim even more to perfect the arguments she always had: “We are the only alternative to Germany. We are the only party that is against the system, but the system has noticed: we are so strong that it has to ban us.” In my opinion, this would increase the electoral success of the AFD and would be anything but in the spirit of democracy. That is why I am in favor of not taking the party ban completely off the table, but at least not starting the process now.

At the same time, one could argue: if the process were started now, the AFD would most likely be gone within three years. Excluded from politics. And sooner and not later.
Well, but the elected AFD politicians could still maintain their political positions if they leave the party. Then they could simply continue as non-party members. Or a new party could be founded, which all former AFD politicians would join. If we think about this carefully, it ultimately means: if we enforce the party ban now, the AFD representatives will have more power than we want in two years. Even if the AFD officially no longer exists. Of course, this is all purely hypothetical. It could also be that the party ban would be a great success and that the AFD could be permanently destroyed. Since we can’t see into the future, I still tend to say no. For now.